TikTok says it’s not the algorithm, teens are just pro-Palestine — The company denied allegations that it has been promoting pro-Palestine content in an effort to sway American opinion::In a blog post, the company denied allegations that it has been promoting pro-Palestine content in an effort to sway American opinion.

    • Enkrod@feddit.de
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      8 months ago

      Yeah well, one can be anti-oppression and anti-apartheid as well as anti-terror, anti-killing-civilians, anti-bombing-hospitals, anti-using-civilians-as-shields, anti-hostage-taking and anti-warcrimes.

      The israeli Government is not the only one with blood on their hands and while nothing can excuse what the IDF is doing, nothing can excuse what HAMAS is doing too.

      Both sides fucking suck, the only difference I can see is that HAMAS is bad for Israelis and Palestinians moreso than the Israeli Government is also bad for Israelis.

      • prole@sh.itjust.works
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        8 months ago

        That’s the only difference you see? Not the extreme disproportionality of the bloodshed? Not the comparisons between civilian casualties on each side?

        • John Richard@lemmy.world
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          8 months ago

          Hamas is like the cave-dwelling dwarf people that America made up for the middle-east to justify killing over a hundred-thousand civilians. Seriously, are we to believe that Gaza has a bunch of Gringotts vaults underneath it?

          Seriously, it is clear that the bombing is not about saving hostages nor destroying Hamas. Would it surprise anyone if they found out that Israel’s far-right government is like the ex that attacks you and then punches themselves and screams like a Karen that you attacked them first… and then when asked for evidence because their wounds look self-induced, they yell… you don’t believe me you antisemitic Nazi!?!

      • spiderplant@lemm.ee
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        8 months ago

        Oh no! Not a German overcompensating for their countries role in the holocaust.

        Both sides fucking suck, the only difference I can see is that HAMAS is bad for Israelis and Palestinians moreso than the Israeli Government is for Israelis.

        • Israel has effectively removed freedom of speech in Israel and are incarcerating thousands of dissenting Israelis (believe it or not this is bad for Israelis)
        • Israel has policies for killing soldiers and civilians if they are going to be taken hostage (dying is generally seen as bad for everyone)
        • Israeli helicopters indiscriminately shooting at the festival are responsible for most of the deaths at the festival on the 7th (pretty bad for Israelis)
        • Israel has killed more Israeli hostages than Hamas and has tried to refuse accepting the return of hostages (I’d be more scared of Israel than hamas if I was a hostage right now)
        • Israel has a 99% civilian kill ratio when targeting hamas in this latest operation (IOF just being a shit army, bad for Israelis to be linked to this)

        If you want to dismantle Hamas for the the operation on the 7th, by the same logic we should dismantle Israel 10x for all their operations since 2003 such as operation lead.

      • UnspecificGravity@lemmings.world
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        8 months ago

        Yeah well, one can be anti-oppression and anti-apartheid as well as anti-terror, anti-killing-civilians, anti-bombing-hospitals, anti-using-civilians-as-shields, anti-hostage-taking and anti-warcrimes.

        Sure, and if you are those things its going to be hard to get enthusiastic about voting for Biden.

      • piexil@lemmy.world
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        8 months ago

        You literally listed off everything Israel is doing. Good job.

        Israel’s killed over 11k civilians since Oct 7th.

        Israel’s bombed over 20 hospitals.

        Israel refused to take their hostages back even when Hamas offered them in exchange for the Palestinians hostages Israel has. Then bombed the locations they know hostages were at.

        • John Richard@lemmy.world
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          8 months ago

          Netanyahu be like… “Hmm, they are going to attack but if I stop them I may still go to jail, but if I don’t then I get more power… Let me have the Kushners put me in touch with Donny to see what he’d do.”

    • 🐱TheCat@sh.itjust.works
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      8 months ago

      Ah yes, the nuanced thinking of a 5 year old - everything is black and white and everyone who doesn’t agree w me 100% is evil

      • Thief_of_Crows@sh.itjust.works
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        8 months ago

        Do you know what genocide is? It’s pretty much the most black and white issue there could possibly be. People who disagree with me on this ARE evil. There is actually such a thing as truth.

        • Ferrous@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          8 months ago

          If it’s so black and white, then why are there numerous international councils, courts, and meetings where accusations of genocide are fiercely debated?

          • Thief_of_Crows@sh.itjust.works
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            8 months ago

            Because Israel is good at propaganda, and the most powerful country ever supports them. It’s not remotely debatable though, the American hegemony just wants it to be.

      • spiderplant@lemm.ee
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        8 months ago

        Ah yes the choice between democracy (fascism lite) and fascism.

        It’d be nice if Americans finally overthrew their system or just voted for other parties/independents.

        Also not everyone here is from the US btw.

        • FaeDrifter@midwest.social
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          8 months ago

          Democracy is demonstrably far less oppressive than fascism.

          If you are actually anti-opression, the choice for Democracy is a no-brainer.

          • spiderplant@lemm.ee
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            8 months ago

            My point is that the incumbent party and the opposition are both anti democracy and authoritarian compared to the rest of the world.

            Look at the police brutality against peaceful activists in the capitol last night and tell me if that was China that wouldn’t be used by the American media to tell Americans how authoritarian China is.

            This is happening under the democrats, the alleged protectors of democracy. Last time I checked freedom of speech was a democratic ideal in America and the right to protest was a human right.

            • FaeDrifter@midwest.social
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              8 months ago

              You’re running in nonsensical circles my dude. First you say “Democracy” is “fascism-lite”, now you’re saying that to be “anti-Democracy” is “authoritarian”.

              Did you slip up and accidentally reveal to the wrong community that you’re anti-Democracy, or did you poorly communicate your original intent and write out the wrong statement?

              • spiderplant@lemm.ee
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                8 months ago

                The ultimatum posed to me was democracy vs god emperor, in this context it is clearly putting democrats as the democratic option and republicans as the theocratic authoritarian option.

                Me saying in response:

                democracy (fascism lite) vs fascism

                Is not me saying democracy is fascism, its me saying the two options both look like fascism from outside the US.

                • FaeDrifter@midwest.social
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                  8 months ago

                  Ahhh that makes a lot of sense now.

                  I want to make my position on this part clear:** there’s no defending the DNC for supporting a genocidal apartheid state.**

                  But like it or not, the DNC is demonstrably far better on LGBT rights, women’s rights, minority rights, and voting rights in the US. They could look similar to you, but with the DNC there is actually a path forward to be better.

                  And also like it or not, Trump will do nothing good for Palestine. Trump fucking hates brown people, he hates Muslims, the situation will get worse for everyone in the middle east and for women and minorities in the US. And long-term, if you all think America is racist and imperialist now, when cristo-fascists take over and really turn America into a white Christian empire that launches a religious crusade against the rest of the world, y’all will realize how good you had it when it was just the neolibs being greedy for money.

          • SeducingCamel@lemm.ee
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            8 months ago

            Good thing our democracy in the US is exceedingly healthy and citizens vote directly and not through sellout politicians. Oh wait

    • fosforus@sopuli.xyz
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      8 months ago

      If you aren’t anti-religious-fascism you aren’t a civilized person. But it seems that more and more “progressives” are falling in that category.

    • FaeDrifter@midwest.social
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      8 months ago

      Sure, but who is the “oppressor” and who is the “oppressed” can flip on a dime based on context.

      A lot of oppressed people eventually find themselves to be the oppressor.

      If you take a hard stance joining any side, you are at some point siding with an oppressor.

      I don’t need to describe how horrific and oppressive Nazi Germany and the Holocaust was. But you take a hard stance siding with the Jewish people, you are siding with the oppressor in the Israel-Palestine conflict.

      I don’t need to describe how horrific the situation in Gaza is, but if you take a hard stance siding with Palestine and Hamas executes a bunch of festival goers, you’re siding with the oppressor.

      The only way to be anti-opression (and according to you, a real progressive), is to not take sides but take every situation as it is and support the best possible outcome for everyone.

      • spiderplant@lemm.ee
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        8 months ago

        Israel doesn’t represent every Jew that ever lived around the world.

        Yes I support the Warsaw uprising.

        Yes I support the dismantlement of apartheid states.

        These are not conflicting stances.

        If the oppressed become an oppressor my stance can change on them. Not taking the side of the oppressed while they are being oppressed is cowardly and indirectly supports the status quo/the oppressor.

        • steltek@lemm.ee
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          8 months ago

          I must have missed history class where the Warsaw Uprising attacked a peace festival.

          Being oppressed is not a license to become a monster yourself. I refuse to condone cold blooded revenge (both Hamas and IDF).

          • spiderplant@lemm.ee
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            8 months ago

            Alright what about warcrimes committed by resistance fighters and the allied forced during ww2?

            If you support those groups even though they have done bad shit then you’re a hypocrite and you should try and understand why you consider them differently.

            • steltek@lemm.ee
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              8 months ago

              You’re demanding to view this as “good team” / “bad team”. Fix that first because it stops any hope for peace.

              • spiderplant@lemm.ee
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                8 months ago

                Did looking at Nazis as the bad guys stop peace?

                But no I’m asking if you support critically or uncritically the allies in ww2.

                If you support the allies even though they committed war crimes and you don’t at least uncritically support an oppressed peoples struggle then you are at best a hypocrite and at worst a racist.

            • Tavarin@lemmy.ca
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              8 months ago

              Hamas wants to get Palestinian’s killed by Israel, that’s their goal. They want their own people to die so Israel looks bad and maybe Hamas can get Saudi Arabia to attack.

              That’s worse than what the allies did.

              • spiderplant@lemm.ee
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                8 months ago

                Hamas wants hostages to do a hostage swap for Palestinians that Israel is holding hostage in their prisons.

                This is true of any organisation fighting a nation state.

                The IRA did hostage swaps with the British government and this was one of the reasons there is peace in northern Ireland.

                https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/oct/18/prisoner-swaps-cornerstone-northern-ireland

                Edit: looking at tavarins comment history it is most likely they are a Zionist mouthpiece. Hope they are getting paid and not doing unpaid labour ❤

                • Tavarin@lemmy.ca
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                  8 months ago

                  Just anti terrorist.

                  And Hamas demanded a 4 day caesefire as part of the hostage swaps, and only offered a small number of hostages.

                  And I have Israeli friends who had to live under Hamas rocket fire.

                  • spiderplant@lemm.ee
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                    8 months ago

                    So your issue is that Israel couldn’t negotiate better or at all?

                    And I have Palestinian friends that have lost tens of family members.

              • GnuLinuxDude@lemmy.ml
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                8 months ago

                At this point i support hamas uncritically because israel is an apartheid state and its stepdad, the USA, is the largest state sponsor of terror in the world.

                • Tavarin@lemmy.ca
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                  8 months ago

                  So you support a terrorist organization attempting to eradicate all Jews, and getting their own people willingly killed in the process. Good to know.

                  • GnuLinuxDude@lemmy.ml
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                    8 months ago

                    i don’t care about the opinion of genocidal freaks such as yourself who sanction ethnic cleansing campaigns. everything you say is wrong and irrelevant

                  • spiderplant@lemm.ee
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                    8 months ago

                    So you support a terrorist state attempting to eradicate safe spaces for Jews outside of Israel by funding antisemitic groups in those countries, and getting Jews killed in the process. Good to know.

          • Karyoplasma@discuss.tchncs.de
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            8 months ago

            That the festival was for peace in Gaza is an onboarding lie spread by the IDF. The festival was simply in celebration of the Jewish holiday of Sukkot. The motto was “friends, love and infinite freedom”, so just about a regular rave.

            Sadly mandatory: This doesn’t make it okay to slaughter and abduct the attendees.